computer use in chess

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dsteel
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Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:42 am

computer use in chess

Post by dsteel » Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:42 am

i,am relativiely new to correspondence chess and the use of a computer to make my moves for me is something thats never entered my head. so while browsing around the internet it came as a bit of a surprise to read that many players believe this is quite common .is this as wide spread as its made out to be

ziggyblitz
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Re: computer use in chess

Post by ziggyblitz » Sun Sep 01, 2013 3:52 pm

Personally i don't believe cheating is a big problem, particularly with the lower ratings. I haven't found much cause for suspicion on net-chess but it may be different with the higher ratings.

Chess.com has a cheat detection system and 5% of my opponents have been banned for cheating. Happily most of us don't see any point in using a computer to find our moves. Where is the fun in that :roll:

ziggyblitz
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Re: computer use in chess

Post by ziggyblitz » Sun Sep 01, 2013 9:58 pm

Sorry, i need to make a correction. Using computer assistance is NOT CHEATING here on Net-chess, as there is no rule against using such assistance, except for specific tournaments such as the Net-chess Open. Although I'm sure most of us expect our opponents to use their own brains.

dsteel
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Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:42 am

Re: computer use in chess

Post by dsteel » Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:30 am

i agree i don,t think netchess has a problem with the use of computers . Like you say wheres the fun . i think the article i read was talking about higher levels i think it was written by jeremy silman [can,t remember the web site it could have been chess.com he was writing for]

gmiller
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Re: computer use in chess

Post by gmiller » Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:41 pm

Using computer analysis isn't allowed for games here at net-chess. I can't imagine any reason for allowing it. Sure, some people might cheat, but if you want to know you're playing a computer you can just play against your own.
Greg Miller

ziggyblitz
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Re: computer use in chess

Post by ziggyblitz » Tue Sep 03, 2013 10:32 pm

OK, computer use is CHEATING, my mistake, but I still can't find a rule forbidding such use.

cleenders
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Location: Amsterdam

Re: computer use in chess

Post by cleenders » Sun Sep 15, 2013 10:12 am

gmiller wrote:Using computer analysis isn't allowed for games here at net-chess. I can't imagine any reason for allowing it. Sure, some people might cheat, but if you want to know you're playing a computer you can just play against your own.
Greg, I think you are pretending ignorance when you state that this site is only for people who do not use computer analysis to find a move. If you really believe that you should ban players who use chesssoftware, like me.

The very essence of this site is to use chesssoftware to better your chessgame. Let me explain.

If you want to play chess for fun there are thousands of sites where you can play blitz, 10-minutes, even one day games.
If you want to chat to the person you play with, and become his friend, hundreds of sites provide that.
If you want to compete, and you are obsessed with ratings, try playchess.com or chess.com, or join a chessclub.
If you want to think about your chessgames, then the field narrows. I find only 3 gameplaysites attractive: FICS (for shorter games), Net-chess (to experiment), and ICCF - the International Correspondence Chess Federation - for serious competition. ICCF requires you are a paying member of your national federation, and often you have to pay an entry fee to play in a tournament. Ah, you earn money when you win a tournament. ICCF explicitly allows computer analysis tools.

Here at Net-chess there is a wellknown, strong base of players who understand the use of chess-opening encyclopedias, gamedatabases, theoretical endings and last but not least chess engines. It is always interesting to challenge and fight them. Enhancing your game with chesssoftware requires a thorough analysis itself. What opening variation? What engine to trust? If 3 moves are offered with practically the same +/- which one do you choose, how to reach a winning position in an endgame? My chess engines suggest a lot, but I decide..

I guess nobody cares much about actual ratings, except for some ignorant newcomers. But an established rating is a fair indicator of your opponent's strength. Please use it to select the people who you want to play against when you start or join a tournament, Adding a clause like "No computers" helps.

What I find special about Net-chess is the loyal base of players, many very strong, and the customary time limits that allow correspondence style games. And: the site is very, very reliable. A big Hurray to you Greg: You spend already over 14 years a lot of energy in making us egotistical players happy.

With thanks, Chris

Note offtopic: why do you refuse to accept payments for your efforts (although you do have a *Donations* button)?

irrawang
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:23 pm

Re: computer use in chess

Post by irrawang » Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:45 pm

The problem I have with software/engine users is that they deceive their opponents. They don't come out and say upfront that they are using software/engine assistance. Why??

I donated to Greg with PayPal....no problem.

twoknights
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Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:17 am

Re: computer use in chess

Post by twoknights » Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:35 pm

"Here at Net-chess there is a well known, strong base of players who understand the use of chess-opening encyclopedias, game databases, theoretical endings and last but not least chess engines."

There are other sites for centaur chess Greg's site like the CCLA provides players like me who only want to play traditional correspondence chess against other people without involving all that stuff a space to breath.

iamachessstudent
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Re: computer use in chess

Post by iamachessstudent » Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:40 pm

Use of computers is generally discouraged, if not outright banned on many websites..
the only thing I cant understand is WHY use a computer to play your games, you are not getting anything out of it and its unfair period.

I do use the databases, books and PC when I did the "Game of the Month" and other analyzing for my friends or the site, but that is totally different than using it during an actually, in-play game!
Hopefully, there is not toooo much of this gong on a at this site... we seem to have a good group of people that just love the game and enjoy playing it!
One of the things I like about this site:)
Happy Weekend everyone!
Joshua

joli
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Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:24 am

Re: computer use in chess

Post by joli » Wed Jan 22, 2014 2:57 am

It´s not fun play against people who time out, who play no good in the opening or do blunders in game. Our chessplay wins if we using computer assistance in a reasonable manner. Still humans are better than computers in playing strategical chess so why play tactical if we don´t like people who "cheating"?
Last edited by joli on Wed Jan 22, 2014 7:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

hurble
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Joined: Thu Dec 19, 2013 9:12 am

Re: computer use in chess

Post by hurble » Wed Jan 22, 2014 6:56 am

Maybe it would be a good idea for people who are using computers to enhance their game to mention it in the comments when they start a game. Players who are opposed to computer use could do the same. That's not to say there won't be people who cheat, but hopefully it would decrease the chances of being involved in a game against an impossibly superior opponent without knowing it.

I say this under the assumption that people who use computers are not cheaters. I don't use one myself (which is obvious to anyone who has played me), but I think it might be an interesting tool to explore at some point. I'd love to deepen my understanding of the game and using a chess engine seems like a natural way to do it. There's no shame in that, but I would definitely want my opponents to know what they were up against. I agree that, at my level anyway, there doesn't seem to be much of a problem with it here. Why would someone waste their time doing letting a computer play for them?

ziggyblitz
Posts: 29
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 7:06 pm

Re: computer use in chess

Post by ziggyblitz » Wed Jan 22, 2014 6:28 pm

In order to improve your play and to have a deeper understanding of the game you analyse your games with a chess engine after the game is over. To do otherwise is just cheating, nothing more.

joli
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:24 am

Re: computer use in chess

Post by joli » Wed Jan 22, 2014 10:45 pm

In a practical way; More playmates if blunders not keep us apart. Birds of a feather flock together. That´s life.
Last edited by joli on Thu Jan 23, 2014 1:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

ziggyblitz
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Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 7:06 pm

Re: computer use in chess

Post by ziggyblitz » Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:59 pm

But are they birds of a feather? I have yet to see a tournament designated "computers allowed" , but I have see tournaments with "humans only" or "no computers" in an effort to keep centaurs out.

Blunders are a part of the game. Chess is a very complicated game. :shock:

joli
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Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 4:24 am

Re: computer use in chess

Post by joli » Thu Jan 23, 2014 1:11 am

Keeping centaur and humans apart reminds me about Chinatown and Smallville. Two different communities.

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